Alumni Conversations: How Dalma’s time at Bird & Bird differs from life in the US legal market

Hi Dalma, could you please tell us more about yourself and the role you held at Bird & Bird?

I was an associate at Bird & Bird in the Dispute Resolution Group and joined the team in April 2015. I started as a generalist, working for all practice groups. I did some M&A, real estate, and litigation work but eventually, after about a year and a half, started working exclusively on litigation matters. I worked closely with László Nanyista, and László and I also collaborated with Bálint Halász (both László and Bálint are managing members of the Budapest office) on a very interesting trade secrets matter. László became my mentor for which I’m really grateful and I can proudly say that we are friends, and we keep in touch—he has provided me with a lot of helpful advice and guidance throughout my career. The Hungarian setup is that after you graduate, you become a junior associate and then you must practice as a junior associate for at least three years to be eligible to take the bar. Then, once you take the bar, you can become an associate. I started as a junior associate and after about three and a half years, became an associate in January 2019. I then gradually started taking on more and more responsibilities.

If you had to describe your time at Bird & Bird with three adjectives, what would they be and why? 

I think my time at Bird & Bird was one of the best periods of my life   So, the three adjectives I picked that best describe my experience are supportive, collaborative and pleasant. Supportive both in the personal and professional sense as the firm, my colleagues, and the partners were fully supportive of my professional development from day one. Let me give you a few examples.  When I was preparing for my Hungarian bar exams, I was very nervous—to the point that I almost didn’t show up for my first exam.  László took the time to chat with me and managed to calm me down.  He said nothing happens if I fail, it happens to the best of us, if I fail I’ll just try again. So, of course, I showed up and passed with great results. Another example is, when I said I was going to move abroad, the partners prioritised my own professional development rather than what was good for the firm and I'm very appreciative of that.
The second adjective would be collaborative. I think the dispute resolution team worked really well as a team. Everybody had their own roles and strengths and was an integral member of the team. We all counted on each other and supported each other. We had to work really hard, but I think it's easier to do that when you know that you're also working for other members of the team. László, for example, always gave me great feedback and appreciated my hard work. The office is also very collaborative in the sense that the different practice groups all work together. I think that's why it's so great to work for a full-service law firm as the practice groups can refer work to one another, and if something industry specific comes up lawyers from different practice groups can seek advice from each other.

The third and last adjective would be pleasant, because the Budapest office has a great work environment. I had a decent work-life balance and really liked going to work. I was able to build lifetime friendships and relationships with my colleagues and still keep in touch with many of them. I just visited one of my former co-workers, Mátyás Schultheiszand his wife, Szabina; they are good friends of ours. They recently welcomed a beautiful baby boy! When I came back home in March, I also went to check out the new office, it's amazing!

Looking back at your time at the firm, what was your favourite memory?

It's hard to pick just one! I would break this question down to professional and personal. My favourite professional memories are when I appeared in court in a speaking role. One time we went to a hearing in another city, and I had to examine a hostile witness. It was not an easy exercise because the witness was everything but cooperative, but it contributed to my professional growth. I also appeared for a client before the appellate court in Budapest and László came with me. Those were some great professional experiences, and I really appreciated the opportunity as I was pretty young at that point. Appearing in court in a speaking role as a twenty something-year-old was a big deal for me. And then personally, I really loved the dispute resolution outing in London in 2019. It was nice to meet our dispute resolution colleagues from all across Europe. There was a fun quiz at the end of the outing, I think our table ended up in a pretty good place - I'm not sure if we won, but I remember we did well.

In 2020, you left Bird & Bird and moved to the United States. Could you please walk us through your career since you left the firm?

I moved to New York in August 2020, but the process started way earlier. If you want to apply for an LLM, you need to start working on your application about 18 months prior to the start date. 2019 was all about filing my applications, preparing for the TOEFL language exam, which was required by all U.S. law schools for international students at that time. In March or April 2020, I found out that I got a full scholarship from Fordham Law School - I was over the moon. When I started the program, it was still COVID so my entire program was online. I had only one class in person (Evidence). I really loved it and loved my professor, he's a great guy. Fordham navigated the new landscape very well and I don't think my education suffered in any way from being online. I was well prepared to take the bar exam. It was just the social aspect of it that was a bit difficult, because there weren’t a lot of opportunities to meet people, hang out, and make new friends. I worked hard during the program because— I knew from my research that Ineeded excellent academic credentials to get a job in this very competitive market. So, I graduated first in my international dispute resolution class and got an award for this.  I also worked as a research assistant to my Evidence professor during my time at Fordham Law School. I started to apply for jobs after I graduated in May 2021, and was hired by America's biggest law firm as a first-year litigation associate, in August 2021.  I sat the New York bar exam in February 2022. I moved to my current firm in February 2023.

Today, you’re working as a Litigation Associate at Golenbock Eiseman Assor Bell & Peskoe, a US law firm. What are your main responsibilities in your current role, and what does a typical day in your life at the firm look like?

To start with the second question, I try to start my day early at around 8am as I find it easier to focus when there are less people around and work until 5-6pm on a normal day. I usually try to get a workout in after work. It’s important both for my physical and mental well-being, to exercise daily or every other day. Then I go home, prepare for the next day, and spend time with my husband. On weekends we always try to do something together or with friends. We recently picked up tennis and we both love it! In terms of my role as a litigation associate, I'm not super senior, because I’m a little bit late to the game. Generally, Americans graduate from law school at the age of 25/26 and then they move to a law firm and start their career. But when I started working as a litigation associate in America, I was already 30 so for me it's a little bit different and I'm trying to catch up. I do a lot of legal research and strategize together with the partners on the case based on the results of my research. I draft motion papers, legal briefs, demand letters, etc. One of the great things about Golenbock is that we do both plaintiff and defendant side litigation. I do a lot of work in connection with the discovery process. Discovery in America is huge; it's a very important —and expensive—part of the process, so it’s not uncommon that cases settle at around the time of discovery. But if the case carries on, then we exchange discovery requests and responses, do the document production, review the other side’s production, and take depositions. Depositions are very exciting! 

So, I basically do everything that a litigation associate does in New York but haven't had a trial yet—hopefully that too will happen soon!

What major trends or changes have you observed in the legal industry since moving to New York? How does the legal landscape in New York differ from Budapest? 

It’s very different in many respects, especially the variations in the two legal systems. Most European countries, including Hungary where I got my law degree, have the civil law system which is based on written codes; there’s a Civil Code, a Criminal Code, a Code of Civil Procedure, a Code of Criminal Procedure, and so on. So, litigation is basically about trying to interpret what the code says or what the law is and when you can't figure that out based on the commentary or the text of the statue, you look at cases and judge made law. The reason I bring this up is because I I had to rewire my brain regarding the way I approach cases and statutes, as it's really different. There aren't a lot of things that I can apply from my Hungarian legal knowledge to my American one, which is the most challenging part. I had already worked five years as a lawyer in another country and then had to get used to something new and adapt to the common law legal system and familiarize myself with all aspects of American litigation.

I think it would have been different had I gotten my LLM or started working in America right after I graduated from law school. But it’s certainly very interesting to see how the two legal systems differ and their pros and cons.

For example, the role of the judge is very different in America.  Hungary has an inquisitorial legal system, and the judge is actively involved in investigating the facts of the case.  In contrast, the US has an adversarial system and the role of the judge is more passive when it comes to establishing the facts.  Relatedly, in Hungary, the judge is the factfinder, whereas in America jury trials are very common, and in a jury trial, the jury is the factfinder.  There are no jury trials in Hungary. Moreover, one of the most commonly used evidentiary tools in America are affidavits.  Hungarian procedural law does not recognize sworn statements—they do not have an evidentiary value. Another example is hearsay. I have to admit, I struggled a little bit with this concept because it's also not present in Hungarian law. It's a very important, but complicated set of rules. Another difference I observed is that it’s not uncommon to have multiple filing deadlines on the same day and you just have to be able to juggle—so that's another skill that I'm learning. I'm very detail-oriented and hate when there are typos left in my work. I like to read and reread and make sure everything's perfect, but usually there's no time for perfection, especially when you get a very tight deadline. You just have to be able to let smaller things go and focus on the big important ones. Yet another difference is that in this market, you really have to put yourself out there and make yourself be seen and heard.   I find this challenging, because I’m a bit shy. Finally, this is not true of my current firm, but the New York legal market is generally a more cut-throat environment with tighter timelines, longer hours, and less personal time so it can be more challenging to keep a good work-life balance. But I do want to emphasise the positive things too. It's a pretty good market for self-starters as there's less supervision, more opportunities, and more client facing, and partners usually support younger associates to step up and take on more responsibilities early on in their career. 

How did you adapt to the cultural differences in the workplace between Hungary and the United States? 

One thing I noticed was the differences in communication, as here in Hungary we're straightforward, but respectful. Luckily, I have my husband to go to for advice as he's been living in the US for 13/14 years now. It's much harder to adapt when you're 29 than when you're 19. Obviously, there is less vacation time as well, but my firm is actually great in that sense. I have 20 days, which is really good in New York, and they do try to respect people's vacation schedules. I would like to point out that New Yorkers are very friendly. I heard a few times that they’re rude but that's really not my experience. I think it’s just that people here are often very busy and are rushing everywhere.  In my experience, New Yorkers are very open minded, and I love that—there are so many cultures and nationalities, it's a really diverse environment!

What were some of the biggest challenges you faced when transitioning from Budapest to New York, both professionally and personally? 

I already mentioned the biggest challenges I’m facing professionally. Personally, it's very hard to be so far from my family and friends.  I have my entire family in Hungary. I have a nephew, he’s two and a half years old, and my niece is about to be born. I also have a lot of friends there and I miss them a lot. Every time we come home it's like a tour: meeting two-three different friends or groups of friends every day and always rushing everywhere. I'm happy in New York and I think we have a great life and I'm very satisfied with what I've achieved so far, but just wish that my family and friends were closer to us.

What advice would you give to young lawyers who aspire to work internationally and therefore relocate?  

I want to put this as a five-step process. The first and most important step, do your research. Research the requirements for practicing law in the country where you want to move and research the interview process. Also research the visa requirements, especially when it comes to America because immigration is tough for Europeans. I think Canadians and Australians have a special visa they can apply for, butfor Hungarians, it’s more difficult. When you decide where you’re going to relocate, research neighborhoods and areas you want to live in, and put a budget together for yourself. The second step is to have a game plan and set a goal: What is it that you really want to do? What is it that you want to study? What are you interested in? Once you decide, it's very important to work hard toward the goal that you’ve set for yourself. I personally believe in the law of attraction and manifestation, and I think if you really want something and set your mind to it, it will happen. Step three, once you relocate, be open to opportunities. Try to say yes to invitations, be social and do a lot of networking, especially in America. Networking is very important here. It's not only helpful in job search, but also once you're at a law firm, you can bring in clients through your network. A great thing about the American legal market is that they're open to younger lawyers bringing in their own clients. Step four, which is connected to step three, set realistic expectations. Don’t necessarily expect yourself to get a job the day after your graduation, because that's not how it works. Leave some time for yourself, and don't expect yourself to achieve things that aren’t realistic, because it will just frustrate you. The last step is not to get discouraged by rejections. Rejections happen a lot and they are not a reflection of your capabilities and qualities. I'm emphasising this because I tend to be someone who does get turned off by rejections and I always think about what it is that I did wrong. What could have I done differently? But, overtime, I learned that I can't control everything. You can't be everybody's darling—maybe you were not the best fit for that position, but that doesn't mean that you are not a good fit.

Finally, what are some of your favourite places to visit in New York? 

Central Park is amazing in every season, especially in the Fall, but it also looks beautiful after a heavy snowfall. It's like a Winter Wonderland. Sometimes very special bird species come to visit all the way from Canada! I'm vegan and New York has an amazing restaurant scene for vegans; there are a lot of great options. My personal favourite restaurant is called “Le Botaniste.” It's a very healthy plant-based restaurant. My husband and I are also both big coffee enthusiasts and there's an amazing coffee shop called Zibetto Espresso on the corner of 56th St. and 6th Ave. We're obsessed;they have the best coffee in town! So, if you want to find me—we're there every morning.